Gentlemen,
The fact of the matter was we wanted the semi-final game played next week; Dream Team had to play 3 games all in one weekend which made it impossible for our core lineup to play the most important game. I was forced to connect from a crappy machince to play as I was not even at home this weekend because we didn't have enough players for game time. A reschedule was refused.
This was the SEMI-FINAL! It did not need to be played immediately.
All previous weeks most teams had 1 or at most 2 games per weekend; not 3. The forced scheduling was unnecessary, ungentlemanlike and dishonorable conduct. We could have easily been accomodated by playing the following week.
Being uncooperative leaves us with a bad impression. Integrity and honor cannot be bought or sold.
I appreciate the effort all the BTT staff went to administer the tournament, but you could have afforded more patience in scheduling the last 3 games. No team deserves to be resented because they live in different time zones, and this bias was clear in the replay chat in the past few games the Dream Team played.
A lot of effort was made on my part to try to ensure we had good communication, even when I was away. It is not a big surprise at least 2 teams flaked at the start, but those team that went the distance should be afforded greater respect and cooperation.
The game should have been left for next week.
- Rob
Well said,Gen. Everyone should know the truth.
Here is the abstract: We had to play 3 games(1 round 4 game, and 2 round 5 games) within 24 hour without negotiation or little bit flexibility, while the other team can skip round 5 to match us directly. Of course there were huge difference in SKILLs if you have much higher ping in US than those in Europe.
GEN_Schwarzkopf Wrote:Gentlemen,
The fact of the matter was we wanted the semi-final game played next week; Dream Team had to play 3 games all in one weekend which made it impossible for our core lineup to play the most important game. I was forced to connect from a crappy machince to play as I was not even at home this weekend because we didn't have enough players for game time. A reschedule was refused.
This was the SEMI-FINAL! It did not need to be played immediately.
All previous weeks most teams had 1 or at most 2 games per weekend; not 3. The forced scheduling was unnecessary, ungentlemanlike and dishonorable conduct. We could have easily been accomodated by playing the following week.
Being uncooperative leaves us with a bad impression. Integrity and honor cannot be bought or sold.
I appreciate the effort all the BTT staff went to administer the tournament, but you could have afforded more patience in scheduling the last 3 games. No team deserves to be resented because they live in different time zones, and this bias was clear in the replay chat in the past few games the Dream Team played.
A lot of effort was made on my part to try to ensure we had good communication, even when I was away. It is not a big surprise at least 2 teams flaked at the start, but those team that went the distance should be afforded greater respect and cooperation.
The game should have been left for next week.
- Rob
it does seem abit unfair 3 games it would of been nice if you guys had your best team
not that we did but still 3 games in 24 hours..
It's not a 'little' unfair, it's outrageous. Essi's refusal to reschedule was moral hazard.
I had made it clear to him and everyone there present that we were at a decidedly large disadvantage because not only did we have 2 subs instead of the usual line-up, I could not play from a proper computer. The game would be an easy win if he refused and he knew that full well.
We'd just finished 2 tournament games and even making it for the 3rd game in the same weekend was a completely unreasonable expectation.
When I saw the original schedule (now edited) I thought there were going to be a maximum of 2 games per team, narrowing the brackets only so far. It was not apparent to me that we would even have a game on Sunday; we'd just advanced 2 brackets from 2 games! Talk about a scheduling nightmare for the winning team; especially since the other team got a 5th round bye into the semi-final.
The BTT staff split up all the work and effort to referee all these games, and yet somehow found it acceptable to expect 1 team to be able to play 3 games in one weekend. That was wrong.
If BuG or the BTT organizers had even a shred of moral fibre they would see that the semi-final bracket should have been reschduled to the following weekend, and that we should have had a RIGHT to request it.
If there is anyone left with integrity they would offer to make up for this egregious mistake and arrange the semi-final for next weekend at a mutually agreeable time.
- Rob
yeah.. show the ami's who's the boss ^_^ (don't take it personally)
GEN_Schwarzkopf Wrote:It's not a 'little' unfair, it's outrageous. Essi's refusal to reschedule was moral hazard.
I had made it clear to him and everyone there present that we were at a decidedly large disadvantage because not only did we have 2 subs instead of the usual line-up, I could not play from a proper computer. The game would be an easy win if he refused and he knew that full well.
Seriously Rob, a reschedule would not make a difference. We, Old Sluts, just wanna finish the tournament now and another delay of 1 week would make it even more boring for us.
GEN_Schwarzkopf Wrote:We'd just finished 2 tournament games and even making it for the 3rd game in the same weekend was a completely unreasonable expectation.
When I saw the original schedule (now edited) I thought there were going to be a maximum of 2 games per team, narrowing the brackets only so far. It was not apparent to me that we would even have a game on Sunday; we'd just advanced 2 brackets from 2 games! Talk about a scheduling nightmare for the winning team; especially since the other team got a 5th round bye into the semi-final.
You talk like BT is a really exhausting game. Where's the problem in playing 3 games at one weekend? I think it was just an advantage for you guys since you could practice more teamwork while our team didn't have the chance to do that. I would agree if you had to play 3 soccer games at one weekend but not when you have to play a computer game.
GEN_Schwarzkopf Wrote:If BuG or the BTT organizers had even a shred of moral fibre they would see that the semi-final bracket should have been reschduled to the following weekend, and that we should have had a RIGHT to request it.
If there is anyone left with integrity they would offer to make up for this egregious mistake and arrange the semi-final for next weekend at a mutually agreeable time.
I don't see any sense in remaking that game. It would just be another waste of time since we would win it 99,9%. It's obvious that our team is a lot better and i don't really get your point why you want a remake. Just leave it be and be happy for a good 3rd place. I won't agree to a rmk because i wanna finish that tournament as soon as possible.
My 2 pence.
Best regards,
Essi
I don't understand why most people only concentrate on things which were not handled perfectly. You should be thankful that you could be part of the first btanks tournament since a very long time and the first one with significant prizes. You should not take the tournament for granted and rant about things which could have been done better in such a disrespectful way. Olivercamel did organize this all just for the community, he spent really a lot of time (he is like the whole weekend online every time since the tournament started plus avaible the whole week in between) and even money into making this possible. You cannot expect that everything runs without any flaws initially, it's the first experience in running a tournament by probably the whole btt-team.
To be honest I'm a bit disappointed by some of the community's reactions to the whole tournament. I expected clans/players to be really excited and glad that finally there could be a real competitive environment established, but I was obviously wrong.
(That said, there is no problem in constructive feedback, but being offensive towards each other is definitely not the way to go.)
My friends,
This is all constructive feedback, I did not use any offensive words, I used very good english. It is simply the truth.
Essi has no right to comment on the trouble we had getting our guys together for 3 games on the same weekend. He only played 1 game. His callous attitude is a reflection of his honor plain and simple. BENNIE.fm immediately messaged me and said he'd offer a remake if it was his decision. He is a true leader, he has honor.
Essi may be correct in saying old_sluts team is probably better than Dream Team, but that only is more reason to ensure the game is played out fairly, and not cheapen the victory by taking advantage of the situation.
The only US East team entered was treated differently. I'm from I'm from Canada not the USA.
Schedule is difficult when our needed game time makes people from Germany have to stay up late. We cannot help this fact, and it's not their fault either. It's no excuse to not to be accomodated on schedule just because they are tired of having to stay up late...it's simply unfair and playing favorites.
The BTT staff know how draining it is to have to be on at a certain time out of their regular day to play a game. It is horribly inconvenient to do this for 3 games in one weekend, especially if you have a life !
Calling something "a moral hazard", or "outrageous" does sound offensive to me and probably many other non-native speakers (Edit: keep in mind that words might have different connotations with different native languages). You say that BuG and BTT organizers have no sense for morals - how can that be not offensive?
Also claiming that a team didn't want to change schedule because they want an "easy win" is offensive (it's basically to claim they play unfair and they act unmorally).
There were obviously things which could have been done better, but statements like those do not belong in any reasonable discussion.
Thought it would be a replay tread :? :?
Quote: He is a true leader, he has honor.
LOL
O
L
Flamme players! Not organizers!
I split the threads, since the discussion didn't belong in the replay thread.
GEN_Schwarzkopf Wrote:This is all constructive feedback, I did not use any offensive words, I used very good english. It is simply the truth.
Essi has no right to comment on the trouble we had getting our guys together for 3 games on the same weekend. He only played 1 game. His callous attitude is a reflection of his honor plain and simple. BENNIE.fm immediately messaged me and said he'd offer a remake if it was his decision. He is a true leader, he has honor.
And there we see your offensive speech. At least i feel in that way if you tell someone out of my team deserves it more to be the leader. So stop acting like a child. That would be the first step to show that you have honor, too! And someone has to be the responsible person to take decisions. And that's me because i am the leader. No need to tell what leader you like to see for Old Sluts.
GEN_Schwarzkopf Wrote:Essi may be correct in saying old_sluts team is probably better than Dream Team, but that only is more reason to ensure the game is played out fairly, and not cheapen the victory by taking advantage of the situation.
It seems you are a bit confused. What advantage do we got yesterday? You seriously mean those 3 games you played at one weekend is a reason you lost? That's just stupid and not true. No matter what you tell in here - our team is better and we would win at any other time as well. So stop whining. Actually i get angry about your ****** comments.
After all you have to see that it's a free tournament. oliver spent a lot of time on it and i think he does not deserve all those flaming in here. Keep that in mind!
Regards,
Essi
well i think its a clearly a misunderstanding on their side about the timing.Even i didnt know about that much of an exeptions there im actually surprised.And considering they had 5 players and played the game i dont see the problem really but lets see what others think of it.
Prog Wrote:I don't understand why most people only concentrate on things which were not handled perfectly. You should be thankful that you could be part of the first btanks tournament since a very long time and the first one with significant prizes. You should not take the tournament for granted and rant about things which could have been done better in such a disrespectful way. Olivercamel did organize this all just for the community, he spent really a lot of time (he is like the whole weekend online every time since the tournament started plus avaible the whole week in between) and even money into making this possible. You cannot expect that everything runs without any flaws initially, it's the first experience in running a tournament by probably the whole btt-team.
To be honest I'm a bit disappointed by some of the community's reactions to the whole tournament. I expected clans/players to be really excited and glad that finally there could be a real competitive environment established, but I was obviously wrong.
(That said, there is no problem in constructive feedback, but being offensive towards each other is definitely not the way to go.)
Thank you Indete...
really thanks =)
the only one who sees the time which got invested in this tournament which really was/is cool to see
Quote:As a conclusion, generally I dislike the Dream Team (not all members ofc), because some of them talk/request too much compare to their skills.
What a terrible thing to say Oli. Dream Team made it to the semi-final, but lacks skills? By the way I don't consider myself greatly skilled at tanks, nor do I pretend to be. My personal skill level should be irrelevant to this conversation, but thank you for tell everyone how you really feel, it's very revealing about how you see things.
Be honest, you began to resent the amount of work it took to do this tournament. I ensured you were kept informed. Since it took more effort to accomodate US EAST you resent us. You said you couldn't wait for us to be out of the tournament.
You knew we were a good clan, we placed 3rd, that's why you invited us to play.
All I asked was that the semi-final game be hosted the following week. You'd think I was asking that the hostbot be from US East...
- Rob
Its really cool to see a complaining team wanting more rematches after they got one, plus the fact that some of the other teams didn't even get any rematches. This argument should be over, they lost, get over it.
GEN_Schwarzkopf Wrote:What a terrible thing to say Oli. Dream Team made it to the semi-final, but lacks skills? By the way I don't consider myself greatly skilled at tanks, nor do I pretend to be. My personal skill level should be irrelevant to this conversation, but thank you for tell everyone how you really feel, it's very revealing about how you see things.
Be honest, you began to resent the amount of work it took to do this tournament. I ensured you were kept informed. Since it took more effort to accomodate US EAST you resent us. You said you couldn't wait for us to be out of the tournament.
You knew we were a good clan, we placed 3rd, that's why you invited us to play.
All I asked was that the semi-final game be hosted the following week. You'd think I was asking that the hostbot be from US East...
- Rob
If I didn't sound nice, sorry about it. Normally I always try to be neutral, but I am also human and sometimes I can lose control to myself under some cases. Didn't mean to talk against you personally. But indeed I spend much much more time for organizing work for your team, more than in total of the other 14 teams I think. And I am still doing it.
Indeed clan TOAF is a big one in US. That's why I invited you and your clan to join BTT. I would've also do it for btow and kctz as well, but cbud and bennie at that time already got teams.
But, I never said the invitation for your clan is a permission that you can do whatever you want. There are still rules there to follow.
Your team complained that the game time was tight, 3 games in 24 hours, and not negotiable. I don't want to discuss 3 games is too much or not. Let's just assume it is too much. But I informed both you and prohunter the game time on Thursday. If you discuss with me earlier, instead of after 2 games already, you know I will try to rearrange it, like many game time I schedule before. (As a matter of fact, after the 1st round, your team mostly have the 19:00~20:00 UTC game time, which for EU teams already late.)
I'm not really in to the BTT, but I followed the forum here and then and I want to speak out to the whole BTT team my greatest appreciation for the work they are doing and especially the work of olivercamel, who sacrifices nearly all his free time for the BTT and has to handle with all these accusations and problems which he really manages great. Keep up the great work!
Edit Gummyman: im glad to see more people who realise that he doesnt have much freetime and that all the time he can spare he devotes to this tournament.You made my day i wanna say tnx to you aswell.