The Kick Command

[DerSatan]

There has been some controversy about the kick command lately.

Discuss here, list arguments for and against kicking, and vote your favorite option. If your preferred solution isnt listed yet, feeld free to ask for adding it.

[mooneye]

kick should be kept to prevent home-sabotage guys.

[Saiyuki]

kick should be kept to prevent home-sabotage guys.

i hope ur not refering to bombing your own base, as it was clearly nerfed on v8.69

# Bombs are only placeable in your own base if an enemied factory is within your base now

i, myself, would like it to be kept the way it is now.

[Jayzer]

As a recovering noob I think the current votekick system more harm than good to new players.

The players that always end up getting kicked are the ones trying to learn how to play and it's discouraging.

It's also used by more experienced players to threaten cooperation from teammates (ie stay in base noob feeder or we will kick u)

What were the reasons for developing the original votekick command? I think that the only reasons why something like that should exist is to kick:
1. AFK players
2. Abusive players

For option #1, I'm sure a script can be developed where the map automatically picks up if a player is afk after x minutes and initiates a kickvote for both teams.

The -afk and -afkai commands exist so even if people need to do a quick errand during a 60 minute game, they won't be useless.

For option #2, "abusive players" could mean abusing other players verbally, or abusing your own team by feeding too much on purpose or bombing your own teammates.

I would like to see some sort of -mute command enabled so that I can ignore verbally abusive players.

As for players that try to sabotage their own team's progress, I've never seen anyone do this effectively in the 3 months I've been playing. But I bet if the -votekick system was abolished it would resurface. Right now the worst thing anyone can do is feed on purpose, or bomb your teammates, but that's pretty avoidable once you notice that the player is goofing off

I think it's hard for a computer to draw the line between people who are playing poorly on PURPOSE because they want to hurt the team, and people that play poorly because they are NEW. BUT I think that, at least in the qualify servers, if you were unable to kick a player for poor performance, that would encourage players to actually HELP the noobs on their teams because in the end they would be protecting and helping their team as a whole. Too often they are just viewed as an annoyance and votekicked. How else can they learn?

just my opinion
thanks
j

[mooneye]

can system autokick a player having more than 20 deaths and the kill/death rate less than 1/4 in bot games?

[Ger-Dyers-Eve]

I have made my Opinion in some other threads, but here's my sumary again:

.) Only detected AFK-People
.) People, who harm the own team with Flaming, extra-feeding and so on

[olivercamel]

I vote to disable the -kick completely or at least in league. The reason is simple, because the -kick is mostly abused.

In my case, 90%+ -kick are used to get rid of the noobs, and some of them are really beginners and trying hard to learn the game. They may quit the game after several non-friendly games. I bet the btanks has scared away many players because the starting of the game is hard. Also it is not fair to kick someone just because they are not as good as you are. If we follow this way, from my perspective many players who kicking someone else should also be kicked.

The -kick is rarely used for the right purposes, which all can be solved in a differently way I think:
- bomb home (this is now limited by the map)
- AFK (it can be easily detected and kicked automatically)
- Feed on purpose (I am still suggesting to have multiple level league bots that ranking players by their points, so in you feed on purpose a lot, you will lose points and finally lose the entry to higher level league bots)

[AGGInator]

I would like to see some sort of -mute command enabled so that I can ignore verbally abusive players.

allready exists...

game intern: /spuelch playername or /ignore playername
or some bots: !mute playername (or first 3 letters) or other trigger..

[Jayzer]

thanks aggi, do the league beta bots have the mute function?

I tried the spuelch command and no dice. And doesn't /ignore block that player indefinitely? I was looking for something more like once a game.

I'd like to point out the presence of the 'leave it as it is' group in this poll... even though they leave no posts explaining WHY, it appears the majority of the people who have read the thread prefer to leave things the way we are.

I just thought I'd post two replays to show why I think the kick command should go. The first one (RaptorXI) is because of bullying and the second one (skytankkick) is because a player was using it to systematically kick his team as the other team got closer to beating us.

In the RaptorXI demo, at around the ten minute mark he asks me to keep my lane's tower up. By the 20 minute mark I lost the tower and we begin arguing. Starting from that point on he stays on my case for pretty much anything that I say and by the 30 minute mark he is trying to kick me every 60 seconds. His reasoning was for "balance" or for "noob" but really there were two worse players than me in the game and honestly I just felt bullied. And with so many votes being started, it's awfully tempting for a winning team to take advantage of infighting to knock out more players.

(My big mistake (that I learned from, btw) was buying star shooters to go up against the heli in my lane (reduced damage against air) and from that point on the double ground stun of heli beat me.)

In the skytankkick demo, I lose a lane to a player when he switches from scout to heavy and cuts off my income so I lagged a little getting my thunder tank. Anyway we start to get soundly beat and around the thirty minute mark blue starts kicking players. The first pick was purple, and when I looked I honestly thought he was afk. So he doesnt have time to say anything because... he was waiting for enough gold to buy a sky tank! Then after that blue tries to kick other players on the team. I saved this demo because I wonder I had been purple, how could I have reversed the vote since it was done by mistake? Maybe he doesn't speak english or didn't notice.

These two demos are from the last 48 hours. If anyone from the "keep it as it is" camp would like to post a demo of the -kick command being used for the forces of GOOD, it would help me understand a little bit better why the votekick command is so important. I've been playing BTanks for 3 months and the only positive thing I've seen it do is kick AFK players, which apparently could be something that the bot itself detects.

thanks
j

ps I know I'm not a great player, and I'd appreciate it if people could refrain from making fun of how I played in those two games. If you have any suggestions for me, please send me a private message.

[AGGInator]

raptor is one of these guys who know all about btanks... :lol:
a real flamer who always try to kick in reason of feeding or balanceing.
if you make a mistake he tells you to do better or KICK!
the funny thing about that is that he isnt a very good player by itself (doing mistakes too) that is makes sense what he's talking about others.
so pls don't care about him. that's also a reason why he was kicked out of some clans or degraded from shaman to grunt.

btw, i don't want to flame anyone, i only want to write down facts... and sry about my english :roll:

to your question jayzer: i never use squelche or ignore. i can't tell you if its enabled somewhere^^

[RaptorXI]

Agginator, you are just a stupid fool.The only Clan I got "kicked out" was BTNK because I went inactive. In opposite to you, who couldn't stop bickering Fun and got banned (you remember him, don't you :wink: ). And I only had two clans since I joined Sake with my other account. I can live with not being the bt-player on earth, but still the top 10-20 on Norhrend, while you are just average.
So stop insulting or I will report your "facts" to people to people who can ban you.

[Saiyuki]

come down kids, yes both of you. or do you wanna experience a ban on the bots and the forum to cool your head of a bit?

[Althend]

Aggi... Raptor.. You 2 are just boob comparing to me, i beat you even with tinker+ice !!! :p

Really, what the point about your fight?

League tend to bring worse from people (it was the case from the previous league and is surely the case now)

The flaming technique is just to make feeders leave and opponent leave so win easier hahahhahaha.

I voted to keep the kick as it is.
I really don't think we should refuse an useful feature because some people act like jerk. Things should get better when final league is realeased and the "player level spread" would be better.

[olivercamel]

if you make a mistake he tells you to do better or KICK!

This is a good example that -kick is abused. I don't think this command is designed for this purpose. So just disable it.

You can tell your teammate how to do better, but there is no right to kick someone just because he is not as good as you are. If we all follow this rule, btank will become a kicking game, and always end up with 1v1 (the best player in team kicks the other 4).

And just my feeling: some of the players, who think they are pro and kicking others in games, are really not that pro. Btank is like there is no best player, but there are better players. The people you are thinking to kick today may become better tomorrow than you are.

[DerSatan]

You can tell your teammate how to do better, but there is no right to kick someone just because he is not as good as you are. If we all follow this rule, btank will become a kicking game, and always end up with 1v1 (the best player in team kicks the other 4).

yep.. i showed BT to a friend lately, playing on a league bot. pretty soon, the game was 2v2 because of 6 succesful kick commands. all the players though its self-evident to kick players with bad stats, like a k/d of 30%, and also kick to balance the teams.

lots of leaver money, endless stalement, after 90 minutes one player lagged out, the other one wrote GG and gave up. i felt really embarrassed for that game, and it reminded my the main reason why im not playing it anymore but only check the forums.

League of Legends for example is also 5v5, and it ends 5v5 about 80% of all games. what do the bot statistics say, who many people are playing at the end of an average BT game?

[SCorpA1]

again is was kicked for balance, because i had 1 / 3 stats and the other team leavers.
why people get kicked with 1 / 3? because its the worst in the team, but maybe it was just bad luck!!
the kick is abused too much!!! PLEASE: change or disable it, its no fun to play f***in 2:2 games or be kicked in the first 10 mins, so its a 2on2

[Althend]

I think that instead of removing it, we should penalize it. Each time a player intiates a kick, it would be recorded. Then he may get penality for it.


I think that feeding is not a good reason to be kicked BUT sometimes some players donùt answer; donùt want to help others and keep feeding. I think we should assimilate it to feeding on purpose.



I also observe another situation. Sometimes, some players do "please kick me, I suck this game" or any other reasons.... It is weird and unapropriate.

[Ger-Dyers-Eve]

About kicking I have a special question: If you are kicked out of the game, will the bot register, that you played 100% of your game (the % stay, which are recommended for the League Bot)?

But nearly all players here in the Thread are staying for that which I seek: Players who not kicking because of just bad luck. Sometimes, I feel mad about 90% of all those players out there...

[eSVau]

Bots point of view there is no difference in being kicked oder leaving.

Maye some of those "plz kick me"-criers will stop such useless requesthock:

[Equiem]

Why is kick still in the game and why was it implemented in the first place? To avoid spammers/abuse?
What about the times you get kicked for not giving up, all the people on the team know eachother and want to "have some fun"?

I'm trying to justify kicking someone but the only real reason I can come up with is when someone is afk for a longer period and that could probably be remade into a automatic script (Please correct me if I'm wrong).

So the reasons to kick boils down to:

• Feeder -If he's trying to learn I dont really mind. Constant duying doing things that are clearly not working, maybe.
  Abuse/Spammer -Squelch, np
  "Kick me I don't have time/bored/whatever" -Just leave then already. Wont change things either way.
  Balance -From my experience when people start kicking for "balance" someone else always leaves, maybe someone disconnects and after a while you end up with a very funny game of 2vs1