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Quote:i suppose if u had 3 long-range hellis middle for a 3k start and you all stayed on the side of the middle lane that his trademaster is on then you could maybe delay the enemy trader pretty good at the start but even with that tactic he can probably still get his trades without dying if he's using his teleport skill and then his invisibility once he hits level 2.
well i just played 2 public games normal mode in the first one the enemy had a trader and he could only do 2 trades before he left cause we always tripple stunt and killed him when he came near that trade master
then the rest of the other team got defeated in 25minutes
in the second game i went trader, it was not that easy this time. i had bunch of players hunting me, but none of them had a heli as start tank so i escaped by blinking above cliffs and trees.
but when i got past lvl 7 they had no chance. then my lvl started to overfly theirs example i was on lvl 18 when they had lvl 11 or lvl 12
i got 3 factories as fast as possible and overwhelmt them with creeps.
in this game a had a player from 1a2b clan in my team who helped me alot in the first 5 minutes, without him i maybe got my ass kicked
i think it depends a lot on what team mates do you have( defensive, aggressive, supportive, egoistic, noobs,...)and what enemys.
when the enemys dont get more money for killing me than for killing much easier targets why should they try?(yeh, i know.. cause they will loose. but they dont know.)
also i noticed something where im not sure if it is a bug or a feature.
i got the trade good from a post, then i dropped it next to a cp to decrease my bounty again.
i did this again and again, example:
i (light force) pick up the skelleton dropp it next to cp,
i pick up a new skelleton move to cp and pick up the old one then i drop both (tradegoods are expandable) and drop both as one single treasurebox
i did this so often, i got about 18 skeletons ready to be changed to cash.
but as long as i was not having the skeletons in my inventory a only had about 200 bounty
then i picked them up cp tp to the cp next to the trade master item tp there and get my cash
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I am pretty sure that if you die, the skeletons that you have 'stockpiled' will also disappear. I don't see how it it really any different to dropping hulls/weapons.
Since you have to get back to that point in order to recover your items - not always a guaranteed thing.
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ChronicStoned Wrote:well i just played 2 public games normal mode in the first one the enemy had a trader and he could only do 2 trades before he left cause we always tripple stunt and killed him when he came near that trade master
then the rest of the other team got defeated in 25minutes
Well there you go. It shouldn't take 3 people to defeat a trader. Their team must have been horrible to be defeated in 25 minutes.
I would suggest.. make the traders HP at 500-800, make it faster and buff its skills. Trader would be more active.
Bring back old Death Magic.
---
Beating rookies makes you a regular.
Beating regulars makes you a pro.
Beating pros makes you an authority.
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I agree with Exodus' idea of adding hp as the trader levels up. The trader should always have enough hp to react to threats but never to actually tank. I also would like to see the trader rely more on its team to defend it. How about replacing the divine shield ability with the longer ladder faerie dragon phaseout (it can't cap or prevent a cap in this state), which would make the trader hold position while team mates rush to help him? And completely banning it from teleporting and giving it a skill that tps it to the nearest ally or cp instead?
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Hmmm so many people are posting suggestions.... Isnt this thread for discussing whether trader is imba or not? Itd be much more effective if it was posted in suggestions forum.
http://forum.btanks.net/viewtopic.php?f=60&t=2088
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Trader is imba in new vers depending if someone hunts the trader. I was playing a hb game on east and there was a trader that was the same level as me and it was 2vs2 me mid it is too overpowered i think personally.!!!  hock:
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DJ.FELLI-FEL Wrote:[...] I was playing a hb game [...]
FAIL!
Stop referring to hb games when discussing whether something is imba or not. Seriously.
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I wouldnt judge balance on hb alone but you realise most bt games are now hb? Already exo has realised this and made small changes affecting hd, for trader it is the fact they dont get x2 xp in HB mode (they get the same xp as in normal).
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either way hb or not trader is so useful and can out level and make money
Cat power < needs to be implemented into bt 
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I don't think trader is overpowered at all.
When the one team has traders, they'll have one less tank than the other team.
And if the other team have tank more than enemy and still can't take any CP at all or they let enemy's traders runs freely then I think it's their own player problem, not Trader's problem.
Complaning Trader is too overpowered because nobody do anything to stop them is like complaining Exploder too overpowered because nobody buy Teleport Breaker.
If someone unable to beat Tinker because he doesn't buy any Mortar Team let Tinker build up all 5 towers before trying to destroy it instead of trying to destroy it while Tinker only have 1 tower, it doesn't mean that Tinker is overpowered.
If someone just keep buying land mines and enemies just keep running into the mines because they doesn't do anything to detect mines, it doesn't mean that mines are overpowered.
If enemies use only short range weapon and you can't get out of their range while they can get you into their range, it doesn't mean that short range weapon is overpowered.
And vice versa, if enemies use only long range weapon and you can't get enemies into your weapon range at all also doesn't mean that long range weapon is overpowered. ( I've seen some thread about these lately, people keep complaining short/long range is too OP )
So basically if you win with trader because enemies are noob that trying to do anything with trader at all or they're lose because they're not using 5v4 chance to get their advantage, I think it's their own problem.
In case that some people just don't know, best method to took against trader after they have Blink/Invis is not to hunt them down, but to get control of the middle lane. And as I stated before, if it's 5v4 and they still cannot get advantage, it doesn't have anything to do with "Trader overpowered" at all, it's just player's problem.
If the team got advantage when it's 5v4, Trader won't be much to concern because soon Trader will have nowhere to go (Some people may say "I still can trade even if all CPs are belonged to the enemy. Yes, I know, but at that point, your earnings would be even lower than playing normal tank, isn't it? ). But if they need 5 players in order to be able fight against 4 players, that doesn't have anything to do with Trader at all, they'd still owned no matter what the last tank is.
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i think your forgetting 1 thing the other 4 tanks besides the trader on the team will level much faster in them middle as it will be 2vs3 will be strong cause creep kills would be shared between 4 players not 5 like the other team trader would just reinforce the fact that the team will be stronger but i think it just depends on your team and trader and the opposing them.JUST my view
Cat power < needs to be implemented into bt
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Sorry dita, how many times have you played trader? i mean the new trader, before the nerf and right after the ground change was introduced. What you are saying seems fairly sound in theory, but ive played a lot of trader games and i know its not exactly like that. Remember, this is the trader-imba thread when it was actually imba (i.e. not balanced properly).
Theres only so much you can blame on players, do you also think hb is balanced? that people do not stop the enemy's strongest player from getting kills or stop dying?
I'll use an example game ive mentioned before, where i managed to trade almost unhindered when we were defending. Having no cps and obviously lost mid. I was hunted by 1-3 enemy air tanks at a time and managed to get a large profit simply by skill alone, i was close to level 25 which meant all my skills were extremely powerful (imba). No one could catch me no matter how many tp's and stuns they used on me. My earnings was MUCH higher than my entire team, and close to my normal trading score. I dont remember my profit score at the end, but it was very high (lost that game).
You are talking about trader waaaay too generally, this is the first version of the ground trader we are talking about, did you read the thread?
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It´s an old thread. I changed my vote here, because i think the second version of the ground tank trader as it is now is quite balanced. (higher manacosts, lesser invisibility duration)
But it is still depending on teamplay, but teamplay is also important in no trader fights.
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mm i also believe that but..trader is still able to out level any tank in game (if trader is good)i asked 22-3 and i was 2 levels higher then everyone in game but trader was 3 levels ahead of me...xp so fast
Cat power < needs to be implemented into bt
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I find the trader weak now. It can easily be hunted down by air tanks, since the trader itself is restricted by ground terrain.
I suggest jump ability:
I think the trader should have the same jump ability as the antigrav. Or something similar to jump. It would look better visually for the trader and ingame. In that way it does ignore tp breakers. Maybe the same jump range values as the antigrav?
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Well if you play 3on2 mid against trader team and got no sucking team try the following.
1 player at least airship or heli: 1 TP breaker including the whole hill where the trademaster is + 1Ward near the breaker, but also completely covers the whole hill. The TP Breaker has to stand over the cliff, so the Trader is directly teleportet in your teams direction and must drive around the whole hill if he teleports to nearby terrain.
You will see with good players not dying and pushing back the enemy team at mid its not realy possible for a trader lower lvl 10 to reach the trade master 
actually I did it one time and trading immediatly stoped. It took about 2 or 3 minutes for the enemy trader till his team with the support of one lane player pushed us so much back, that the trader could unload. In usual public games there are to less players using TP Breaker and wards in an early game state to try it, but it works good #
[I know it costs 300 for Breaker and about 100 for 1 ward ? but if you buy it just some times the enemy trader is completely stopped and your 5player team fight against "4 1/2 Players" ]
Its important that the middle creeps are often killed by the enemies towers, because the creeps are split to less players.
IMO the trader is still very good against unskilled players or better said players who got no experience in hunting traders. But in a game with skilled players a trader can suck very easy when a lot of wards and teleporters were used. (Thats means it is worse enough to suck against good players, but good enough to overwhelm unexperienced ones )
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I think its hilarious how i havent played trader since the time i went trader almost 20 times in a row, just before nerf.
Considering how rare trader is in normal games (ive seen it played a total of 5 or 6 times since the new trader), wouldnt keeping the old setup be good? or give trader something 'more powerful' to make it fun and worthwhile to play?
Trader is a completely different tank, much more than exploder or tinker... so maybe it can recieve some kind of 'imba' bonus. Balance doesnt have to mean 'average' or 'not too strong'. Making values linear and not too high is an easy way to balance in theory but in turn, nothing is really spectacular. Trader has useful and interesting skills but it still plays out quite dull.
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Maybe add back the flying variant of the trader? for 5k? For late game trading? It can have the same old abilities of the old trader and could have 2.5k hit points?
Just a suggestion...
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A Trader Fortress for 16k :mrgreen:
Well, but the idea of adding something so that you can really play trader later would be nice. Its a big problem of real trading against good players when nearly everyone got a teleporter.
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