New "ban-request-reason"? Kickreason required?

[gozo1985]

Hello,

Becouse sometimes it happens and its really annoying:

Your team is start losing... its not your best BT-day and your stats suck a bit and you died a few times without any luck...

your team is starting a giveup vote but you believe in fighting back/ dont want to give up/ dont want the enemy to get angry becouse they not allowed to finish the game like it should be (destroying base)...

and then they start to kick you.. becouse you the only one not typing "-giveup"...


Result:
You got kicked (penalty)
Your team lost (loosing ELO)
Enemy team maybe pissed becouse of the (maybe unnecessary)

So is that OK????
I have no problem if they want to kick you becouse you fed too much (its not that nice but all in all its ok). But getting kicked becouse you not giving up..... thats so annoying.

So here my questions/solution suggestions:

1. Disable giveup vote and include a "draw" & "giveup(new)" command instead which is possible if BOTH teams agrees (giveup the team loses which started this vote or whatever)
2. May you start a ban request becouse they kicked you becouse you not voted -giveup??? (is it even "allowed" to kick someone becouse of that?)
3. Kick commands requires a reason (necessary if my question at point 2. is answered by "yes") - this makes clear WHY you got kicked... and so you have an argument if you save the replay/reason if something wasnt correct.

[axls]

IMO,
Ad 1. a) Draw - can't imagine situation that it would be useful.
Ad 2. b) Why you want to ask your opponent about giving up? If u are in team which want to give up (and you don't, coz You think you can still win) just dont vote and try to convince your teamates. You want to avoid giving up your team by opponents vote? Your "giving up" is good thing for opposite team, because they have easy (and faster) win.
Even if for some reason opponents don't want to let you giveup (maybe players want to boost their stats), this kind of modification would cause lots of "deny of playing" ban requests, because frustrated and resigned players will stop play.
Ad 2. Yes
Ad 3. Hard to enforce. You can make ban request if You think that your teammats kicked you without any reason.

[griffin1987]

IMO,
Ad 1. a) Draw - can't imagine situation that it would be useful.
Ad 2. b) Why you want to ask your opponent about giving up? If u are in team which want to give up (and you don't, coz You think you can still win) just dont vote and try to convince your teamates. You want to avoid giving up your team by opponents vote? Your "giving up" is good thing for opposite team, because they have easy (and faster) win.
Even if for some reason opponents don't want to let you giveup (maybe players want to boost their stats), this kind of modification would cause lots of "deny of playing" ban requests, because frustrated and resigned players will stop play.
Ad 2. Yes
Ad 3. Hard to enforce. You can make ban request if You think that your teammats kicked you without any reason.

1) Ever played a 3 hour+ game, where both team agree that they don't really care so much anymore?
Edit: there's actually another situation which happens quite frequently unfortunately - if there's a 2 player difference in teams. I'd vote for draw anytime then, because a win is only earned if it's fair. At least that is what I think.


2) I hate it when the opposing team gives up. I'm not playing btanks to win - would be the dumbest reason ever actually. I play to have fun. Granted, I always WANT to win, and TRY my hardest to win. But only straight and fair, and I hate it when ANYONE tries to giveup. And if people get frustrated so easily and then deny to play - yeah they should be banned. Really, play some single player games if you want to stop playing anytime.
3) I actually did that once, because there was one player in the enemy team who didn't want to giveup, and then they kicked him for that. To me, that's everything else but fair, and such people should rethink why they are playing an online teambased game.

[UnifiedDoom]

1) Ever played a 3 hour+ game, where both team agree that they don't really care so much anymore?

I think the opposite, the more time I've invested in a game the more I care about it otherwise I would have left ages ago. 3 hours of playing with the game 4 people can create a kind of "bond" beetween them even if they don't know each other.

Edit: there's actually another situation which happens quite frequently unfortunately - if there's a 2 player difference in teams. I'd vote for draw anytime then, because a win is only earned if it's fair. At least that is what I think.

Thats a nice way to think, but do you honestly think everyone else is as morally righteous as you? Most people (myself included, sadly) would be more than happy to take what they can get.

2) I hate it when the opposing team gives up. I'm not playing btanks to win - would be the dumbest reason ever actually. I play to have fun. Granted, I always WANT to win, and TRY my hardest to win. But only straight and fair, and I hate it when ANYONE tries to giveup. And if people get frustrated so easily and then deny to play - yeah they should be banned. Really, play some single player games if you want to stop playing anytime.

Not everyone plays for the same reason though we cannot make rules to benefit those that play for one reason but not the other. Even if you do play for fun look at it this way: your team is an arguementative mess, your score is bad, your playing like shit, your team is playing like shit, and you have no hope of winning, are you having fun now? Giveup saves you time without giving penalty I have never seen people kicked for not giving up enless they were already playing badly.

3) I actually did that once, because there was one player in the enemy team who didn't want to giveup, and then they kicked him for that. To me, that's everything else but fair, and such people should rethink why they are playing an online teambased game.

This is the one situation I might agree with you on. But these "non-giveup'ers" are not always simply playing for the noble concept of "fight until the end." I know they often don't understand the chat around them or sometimes have it completely disabled. They may well simply not understand the -giveup command itself or how to approve it. Perhaps they simply weren't paying attention to chat or didn't react fast enough to their team's proposal.

[gozo1985]

i still think giveup ruins the game... its over when one of the bases is down and not if you think "we cant get back anymore"

we should even think about an easier way to get back... right now its too hard.. even with a well coordinated team thats a fact - BUT its really no reason to give up... giveup is for pussies sorry but thats my honest opinion.

[LoveComesAgain]

got kicked cause dont want giveup and i had not bad stats

http://league.btanks.net/game.php?gameid=24350