Who gets how much Force Gold

[Andibert]

Hi im just inventing some new Strats.

But i have a problem.

I dont know how exactly the money the force earns is send to the players (i.e. if all force gold is given to the players)
I also want to know how cps influences the income u get. I think there is some balance for the bigger bounty the enemy gets from creepkills.

I didnt find some hints in the forum, so i hope u can help me.

Greetings

Andibert der Grüne

[Exodus]

The income every second is calculated that way:

Code:

32 / (NPT * 3 +5)

NPT = Number of players in your team.
As you can see, the CP's don't influence your income.

Regarding the force gold every 5 minutes, it works this way:

Code:

ForceGold * 4 / (NPT * 9 + 15)

The ForceGold is the gold your Force earned in the last 5 minutes. After the gold has been distributed the ForceGold is set to 0. I have to say I'm not sure why Bob made it work this way ... but it seems to work ingame.

[TKF]

I didn't know that. And I thought before that the force gold was subtracted 2000-3000 gold due to the double force upgrades ^^

I made some calculations...

Code:

32 / (NPT * 3 +5)

Gold income for every second for each player:

100% Efficiency = 8 gold distributed every second to players

Do the calculation by yourself to get the

5 players = 1.6 gold every second for each player (100%)
4 players ~ 1.88 gold every second for each player (~94%)
3 players ~ 2.28 gold every second for each player (~85.6%)
2 players ~ 2.90 gold every second for each player (~72.7%)
1 player = 4 gold every second for each player (50%)


Good teamwork might oppose the oneman army principle here due to lower total player income when it's less players.

Code:

ForceGold * 4 / (NPT * 9 + 15)

Force gold ratio distribution:

5 players = 33.33% (6.67% for each player)
4 players = 31.37% (7.84% for each player)
3 players = 28.57% (9.52% for each player)
2 players = 24.24% (12.12% for each player)
1 player = 16.66%

In fact the force kills will only max be effectively distributed op to 1/3 and divided by 5 for each player. This proves that it's better to be killed by the force rather than the players.

This sounds strange, but a full team will receive a third from the force together, while a single player will only get one sixth for himself. But this is probably for giving a teamwork a possibility to beat one man army. So being alone is quite advantage, unless they are bad at teamworking and you eat them one by one and gets stronger.


The force have 4000 gold, there are 4 players on the team (early game scenario)

ForceGold * 4 / (NPT * 9 + 15)

4000 * 4 / 4 * 9 + 15

16000 / 51 ~ 313 gold does each player get from the force



The force have 13500 gold, there are 3 players on the team (late game scenario)

ForceGold * 4 / (NPT * 9 + 15)

13500 * 4 / 3 * 9 + 15

54000 / 42 ~ 1287 gold does each player get from the force

[Batto]

But wasn't it said before that the nr of cp you have influences the force gold you have because you have less creeps to kill? Dont know exactly what topic it was in, but it was said that the more cps you own, the bigger the force gold you get?!

[TKF]

Yeah I thought so before. But owning CP's don't increase your income.


I think there are other income effects which decides how much gold the force gets every 20 sec (Destroying enemy factories for example will give the force bonus gold income every 20 sec I think)


I wish owning more CP's had sort of influence over your gold income, so you could earn some more gold. The force could reward you with more gold or penalize you if you own less CP's. It would also be cool if you were rewarded with 100 gold each time you capture a CP.

________________


For example if the CP's was included in the income every 5 min from the force, it could look like this:

Code:

ForceGold * 4 / (NPT * 9 + 15)

to

ForceGold * 4 / (NPT * 9 + (24 - (CP controlled by your team * 3)))

The total number of CP's is 6

100% = The total gold amount the force have


Owning all CP's

5 players = 39,16% (7,84% for each player)
4 players = 38,09% (9,52% for each player)
3 players = 36.36% (12.12% for each player)
2 players = 33.33% (16.67% for each player)
1 player = 26.67%

Owning half of all CP's (Normal start)

5 players = 33.33% (6.67% for each player)
4 players = 31.37% (7.84% for each player)
3 players = 28.57% (9.52% for each player)
2 players = 24.24% (12.12% for each player)
1 player = 16.66%

Owning no CP's

5 players = 28,99% (5,80% for each player)
4 players = 26.67% (6,67% for each player)
3 players = 23.53% (7,84% for each player)
2 players = 19.05% (9.52% for each player)
1 player = 12.12%


So a team with no CP's would receive about 25% less gold from the force than a team with all CP's


But currently the CP's is not included in the income calculations.

[[BW]Mutley]

I wish owning more CP's had sort of influence over your gold income, so you could earn some more gold. The force could reward you with more gold or penalize you if you own less CP's. It would also be cool if you were rewarded with 100 gold each time you capture a CP.

It would be a nice idea, but if not well calculated, it can change the game in a way its too hard to overcome a wining side.
One thing that makes this game so funny is that if you are losing, you start earning a bit more gold (since you kill more creeps) This helps you to stand longer and force your enemy to play better to actually win.

[SirJoghurt]

I wish owning more CP's had sort of influence over your gold income, so you could earn some more gold.

it was changed.. and it's good that the CP, dont change something on the Gold income....

you need more gold ? earn it by creeping, creeping, creeping , don't know how ? learn it and dont let other "things" let get you gold :mrgreen:

[Bob666]

it isnt true that more CPs dont give more money to your team...

but its in the spawning trigger... when the units are spawned, the team which owns the CP gets the units bounty*4 (or *2, not sure)... this only counts for CPs owned additionally to the 3 CPs you have at start

destroyed factories give the bounty of the not-spawned units * 2 to the opponent force every 20 seconds...

now, that what we changed: the income per second is not changed when one team has more CPs

[TKF]

So the force now gets 24 or 48 gold each spawn for each CP you own? That's why force gold is is higher for the side with most cp's?

[Vomitus]

destroyed factories give the bounty of the not-spawned units * 2 to the opponent force every 20 seconds...

Do player's factories overcome this penalty?

[qweqqweq]

that's way too complicated of an explanation. i jsut wanna know, who gets more gold? the guys with the extra cp's? or the guys with less cp's?

also, who gets more gold if u build an extra factory? the guys who got the extra factory? or the guys who don't?

[kittyonmyfoot]

Given the calculations... then the people that own the cps have 100% effciency of their unit's produced and the people that are fighting them will have 70%+ efficiency depending on how well they farm. Since u need to fight instead of farm 70~85 should be about right.

Ergo... the side with less CPs should have 15~30% less income

If you start to loose base factories then things go decidedly in the other team's favor. Unless u replace them and your units are able to farm better for you.

[Morkardar]

Found one MAJOR Drawack in this!
If the fight is going on very long.

Maybe tinker on one side with super towers, but no base left + Very good players.
They lost base CPs very early and bought three team CPs.
The base got killed near lvl 13.

The winner team will not lvl up any more!
I had this both ways!
The winner team has hard way to level, unless you make a major enemy tank kill all the time.
And if you do this, this situation will not occur anyway.

This way I managed to win games, other people allready thought we have lost.
You lvled to 25 due to the mass of creeps and kills as "loser team" and bought a better tank.
The other team bought weapons every 5 minutes with upgrades from force.

I was a better lvl 25 tank then and owned them.
They were lvl 15.

Solution:
Maybe give killed and owned CPs an EXP-Overtime bonus.
You maybe get 100% gold now... but 0% exp if you win.

[Exodus]

Yes, this is a known problem. The question is, how to find a nice solution for this. Because, it would be rather easy to just add the lost XP to every tank each 20 seconds. But getting experience out of nowhere 3 times a minute is not the best thing to do. Another possibility would be, to increase the xp of the remaining creeps, but this only works as long as there are creeps. When nothing is left, you'll get nothing again.

[DerSatan]

maybe count the XP lost by units that didnt spawn.

the next time a hero is killed of that team, the killer gets that XP, and the counter resets.

:mrgreen:

[Gammagulp]

Maybe give Xp to killing of Player creeps, or did they already give XP ?

[TKF]

I wonder how the force gold system should be changed if if would be renewed.

1 solution is to substract 2900 gold (the upgrades) every 5 min and share the force gold 100%. I don't know if that would be to much. I guess it would....

[FAM_Plyvak]

meybe if one team destroy some enemy factories, their creeps will be giving less gold and xp.
for example dark force destroyed 2 light force factories from base. so light force for killing df creeps will earn 20% less gold and xp.
if there will be no factories in lf base (7 destroyed if i remember good), the light force players will earn only 30% gold and xp for killing df creeps

and imo, there should be more gold and xp for killing creeps spawned from factories builded by players

[k-bones]

Yes, this is a known problem. The question is, how to find a nice solution for this. Because, it would be rather easy to just add the lost XP to every tank each 20 seconds. But getting experience out of nowhere 3 times a minute is not the best thing to do. Another possibility would be, to increase the xp of the remaining creeps, but this only works as long as there are creeps. When nothing is left, you'll get nothing again.

If you do that, I think you should give some extra advantage for the defending team. Remember that destroyed base is not only less cash for attackers, it's less force cash for defenders. In most late games IF you finally manage to draw the attackers back even with your base destroyed and player factories built, you most probably lose the map to them again as you lack force cash and those extra 3 base factories that you can't build. Try testing the game with max number of factories=2+amount of base facs destroyed.

[Exodus]

Just yesterday I played a game against a team that was upgrading its own force and build 3 factories to push mid. They eventually destroyed all of our factories in the base but in the we still managed to win (after 2.5 hours).

But why should the defending team get any advantage for letting the enemy destroy their base?