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Mid Lane Sucks
#1
There is a clear imbalance of lanes here, 3 lanes for 5 people (not to say thats imba, see Dota) but the exp distribution is just horrible.

Side Lanes: 1 creep spawn per tank 100% exp per person
Middle Lane: 2 creep spawns for 3 tanks 66% exp per person

Now this is of course assuming all people get an equal share in kills, well thats hardly ever the case. 9/10 times theres a tinker in mid, enemy tinkers aren't a problem with the various array of seige weapons, however the real threat is YOUR OWN tinker, I'd say, if he gets going he fields like 3/4 of the creeps every spawn, leaving the other 2 players in mid dirt broke for probalbly the rest of the game. While his allies work hard to cover him he reaps the benefits of a FREE tank. Mid lane is dominated by tinkers and long range, there's hardly any room for anything else, mid range just gets wiped out. With all the idiots shouting "Top Solo" and "Bot Solo" at the beginning of the game and being totally anal if you even so much as tp to their lane, It is impossible to switch out of mid for better luck elsewhere. These same players when they start losing then accuse you of being under levelled or feeding when the game ends. Any non-tinker/longranger is bound to be totally fucked over when playing mid, some tinkers even block the goddam holes around the shop making it impossible to manuever as a land tank. 20 minutes into the game I'm walking around at lvl 7 and my two side laners are lvl 11, they haven't even set foot in the tinker infested hellhole that is the middle lane. When the game progresses i'm horribly behind in gold and exp compared to everyone else and hardly a threat to anyone. So im basically forced to play the rest of the game as support whether I want to or not. Something needs to change. Anyway just see my replay if you don't understand what I'm talking about.

I'd Say:
-Equalize exp distribution based on proximity, not last hits.
-Make it impossible to block ramps/chokes/etc with towers. (This could be as simple as no towers within a 100 range of other towers)
-Make towers complete like scout towers with all damage sustained upon completion, rather than completion based on full health.
-Increase mid spawn, maybe not by a whole spawn but like add an extra bastilla or airship spawn, something sublte to cope with the 33% loss in exp per player.

P.S. I didn't know my creeps were actually getting stuck, I Thought my food limit hit it's maximum regarding the bottom lane factory.


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#2
Hey this happens alot to many people are victims of tinkers blocking taking all the money etc

You also make the point if xp is share equally middle you are left behind
most of the time however if your speaking from a public game its hard to argue....i see that tinker is the cause problem of so many league games The bug pro does not allow tinker ....i don't see why they cant disable tinker in league its used so much by pubs sometimes in a pub you get 2-3 tinkers same team with no hull for 5-8 minutes which causes mass feeding.

I would like to see maybe 2 mid creeps that would only come from the middle lanes

From a priv view i would still like to see 2 creeps added (for mid only)

In private games team work is alot of fun and mid is exciting its hard i like it how it is atm.

But 95% games a pub i think some action should be taken so we don't get complaints and replays of these tinkers who we are all victims of
Cat power < needs to be implemented into btSmile
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#3
I agree it is the truth that mid creeps are shared by 3 players, if in case the creeps are equally distributed, the mid players get less gold and XP compare to the lane players. It is also often in the priv games, if the lane players are good, they grow up faster compare to the mid players.

But there is a fact you ignored, that there are normally 3 + 3 players at middle, but at lanes it is 1 + 1. It means the chances you kill a tank at middle, is a lot higher comparing to the lanes. With good team play, it can easily create 2v1 or 3v1 at middle to get the tank kill, even if 1 team uses mass long range tactic.

So what i am saying is, a good team at middle, can get more gold and XP from tanks instead of creeps, comparing to the lane.
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#4
the hb was removed because it cause imbalances right?

i say: in every case tinker is doing it, too. if the tinker is worse the other team get fed by him and he turns useless.
is he too strong he's cutting his mates throats.

i saw only about 10% balanced games with tinker within my btanks time.

suggestion: TO AVOID IMBALANCES BAN THIS FUCKING STUPID NONSENSE OUT OF LEAGUE!!!!
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#5
As I'm currently on a league tinker start project to get a grip of the potential of tinker i can say based on my ~20 (I know it's not that significant right now) games that on average the tinker gets around 100 creepkills until 10th minute, similar to all other tanks. From there on 3 things can happen:

  1. 1.Tinker changes tank in the timeframe from 10th-20th minute, creeping similar as all other tanks.
    2.Tinker stays tinker and gets completly destroyed by 4k+ tanks
    3.Tinker stays tinker and the opponents do not get any 4k+ tanks or siege pack (can be read as "are really bad") -> tinker creeps a lot

Only the first option is possible for any higher level btanks game.
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#6
Prog Wrote:As I'm currently on a league tinker start project to get a grip of the potential of tinker i can say based on my ~20 (I know it's not that significant right now) games that on average the tinker gets around 100 creepkills until 10th minute, similar to all other tanks. From there on 3 things can happen:

  1. 1.Tinker changes tank in the timeframe from 10th-20th minute, creeping similar as all other tanks.
    2.Tinker stays tinker and gets completly destroyed by 4k+ tanks
    3.Tinker stays tinker and the opponents do not get any 4k+ tanks or siege pack (can be read as "are really bad") -> tinker creeps a lot

Only the first option is possible for any higher level btanks game.

I've got some issues with this, mainly that you're too goodSmile There's a few things that you're missing:

* Are you blocking everything for everyone on your team in mid(which most tinkers do)?
* Tried playing vs a full team of long range? Your team-mates wont be able to move out at all, either that or head back to heal constantly not having any time to creep.
* Tried playing without pushing out with your towers to help your team get more ground?

All these things are vital and I doubt you're seeing the same result as with most other good (albeit extremely selfish) tinkers and these are the ones that completely ruin games. These are also the ones getting the 75%+ income from creep slowly making the 2 others on the team useless.
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#7
well.. i'm against limiting towers in an area, but how about a penalty of 2% on all stats ( dmg, attack rate, .. ) for each tower in an area of 100 instead?
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#8
how about just make some of the choke point areas like blight, that would make them unbuildable on to prevent blocking, tinkers could still pile up as many towers as they like.
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