How about making a btank tournament?

[olivercamel]

i'm not convinced that a real money prize is something to mix up with a "fun" map after all.

All kinds of games and sports are in fact for fun at the beginning. When you start a new game, you feel fun to learn new stuff. But after some time you become a pro, and then you will feel boring to beat the noobs - that's too easy. So people would like to play vs pros for more challenge, or go to other games.

So for all most popular games, like SC1, WC3, and dota, you will see the professional leagues. That's is the way to attract good players keep training themselves, and become better and better in the game. This is the same in sports, like football, basketball, etc.

My REAL point is: btanks should also have a way to attract good players, by making a tournament for top teams to prove themselves. If you just want fun for self you can join the league bot with random players. But if you want to go higher, you can find a team, train it with mates and win the btanks tournament.

The little winner prize is NOT trying to combine commercial with fun, but it is trying to help for the tournament going well. If we can make such a tournament easily without money, I'd ofc like that. But the fact is, without the support in commercial, it is harder to make the tournament. That's why you see all the professional sports leagues, as well as the games in WCG, are supported by funds from companies.

And after all, the tournament (if happens) will be just 1 time thing. So it won't change the way how you have fun with the btanks as before. In fact I am afraid this may be the only chance to make a tournament. Because after SC2 comes out, many people will leave WC3. At least won't spend as much time on btank as like now.

Honestly, I am a little pissed off because I didn't know I have to convince people, even the mapper, like this. If I knew it would happen, maybe I'd reconsider before making the tournament suggest.

[Exodus]

Well, before organizing a full fledged tournament with real prize money for the winners, try to get some experience organizing a tournament by starting one without prize money, just for fun.

There are several problems, which could occur during such a tournament. We already had tournaments in the past and although they were pretty exciting, there were some things, which made the organizers stop making new tournaments. For example, a lot of people showed interest in the beginning, but when the time came and the tournament started, a lot of them didn't even show up. Sure, you can disqualify them, but with only half the teams it's just not as good.

So I'd say, lets start a tournament, without prize money first and lets see how it workes out. Give all teams a preparation time of about a month and then start the games.

I think such a tournament could be easily started. Just open a thread, where all teams can register themselves, give a date when the tournament will start and Paladon will surely mention it in the loading screen of the next version to attract more attention.

[Lezowski]

why not just make the prize the ability to name a new item or tank?

Shit, I could do that right on these forums.

[Paladon]

I can agree with Exodus.

[Prog]

For example, a lot of people showed interest in the beginning, but when the time came and the tournament started, a lot of them didn't even show up. Sure, you can disqualify them, but with only half the teams it's just not as good.

Prize money is one (maybe the only) way to prevent exactly this. Why would someone not show up when he can win money?

[eSVau]

i have some experience with online tournament and i can asure you, there are always people that wont show up even with prizes involvedhock: . And i know that it's not easy to organize such a tournament.
It will need some work to start it and much work (read: communication) to keep it running.

So i wish you luck and i also would like to see it as an official part of btanks.net

[HausAmStyx]

I just want to say i think its a good idea, to make such a tournament. but i got a question about he prize money.
who pays it? must every player who wants to play pay for the tournament? or do you want to pay it just with donations?
i think u should first try to organize a prizless tournament, and if it succeed you can try one with prizes.
but anyways i'll try too join ^^

[cyberrabies]

If such a tounry goes forward, can we rather get a dedicated hamachi host. This would even the playing field of delay for players in countries such as australia (such as myself).

Also I would like to show my interest from the Australian server Bored Aussies on this issue, im sure many of our players which mostly belong to our clan would be interested in playing.

[olivercamel]

who pays it? must every player who wants to play pay for the tournament? or do you want to pay it just with donations?
i think u should first try to organize a prizless tournament, and if it succeed you can try one with prizes.
but anyways i'll try too join ^^

To make myself pretty clear:
1. The coming btank tournament will be absolutely free for all players who want to join. There will be no entry fee or whatsoever.
2. I, btank id olivercamel, will pay for the winner prizes, with no extra conditions at all attached to the btank community, e.g. no advertisments etc.

The reason I'd do the donation for btanks is purely because I like this game, and want to contribute a little to make the game more popular.


However, the discussion we had so far, has not agreed by the mappers yet. So it could be that the coming btank tournament is prizeless. But on this point, I agree with Prog.

To Exodus, have you ever thought about why the last btank tournament was not so successful? and why the team didn't show up? My explanation is that the tournament is not so attractive to them. To make the tournament more attractive, in my opinion we can improve in 3 aspects this time:

(1) Better organization, e.g. all the games should be well arranged and the teams should be informed a lot in advance before the time that the game is started. So that there is no way the players can forget the game.
(2) Win honors, i.e. the tournament info and the winner teams will be announced officially in btanks webpage, and probably kept forever. So the players can have their name remembered.
(3) Win prizes. I do appreciate players like HausAmStyx, who would join wether with prize or not. But you cannot deny for many people, if with possibilities to win some money, they will feel that is more attractive.

If we really start the tournament, I'd like to do (3) and some work in (1). I can also help to do (2) for making texts, but the btanks web admins have to do the major job for publishing.


I think this will be the last time to explain myself, and I feel I have already said enough about my motivation. But if the btank high level managers still disagree the idea, I am totally fine with it. In that case, i will just close this discussion and wait for the organized tournament. Btw I'd also like to join it with or without prizes.

[olivercamel]

I d rather see this money for the dev :p

This issue is actually also considered.

If we are going to run a tournament, for every game we will need a referee to show up and judge the game and save the replays etc. So in total it is required for 3-4 referees for the tournament. The referees will be paid for their works too. The prize is 50EUR, as the same as the 1st team member will win.

The btanks mappers, namely exodus, paladon and velo, are the best options to be as the referees, because (1) as the mappers they are more neutral without prejudice for any btank clans, (2) they know too much about the map, and it is a little unfair for them to play vs other players.

If the mappers refuse to take this invitation, the DevTeam members will get the 2nd highest priority to be filled in the position.

Although this is not purely donation for the map dev., but it is intended for this purpose.

[Velocity2k]

But if the btank high level managers still disagree the idea, I am totally fine with it. In that case, i will just close this discussion and wait for the organized tournament. Btw I'd also like to join it with or without prizes.

I like the idea. For me there would be almost no difference between a tournament with or without prizes.

Referee would be an option for me (depends on the day & time). I could also host another bot if needed. I think most of you know the league beta bots hosted on one of my servers. I could also let the bot connect to a pvpgn server. So people without a bnet account are also able to participate.

And btw: the bots are also able to record a replay.

[Paladon]

Well, then i'd be up for organizing a special tournament mode/map.

[kingnounours]

i vote for a 1 game for each round except quarter of final (2 of 3)and final (2 of 3)
5k alternative
Random tank everyone, anyway we can do -playerswap X for change of tank with an allie

[Prog]

I recommend league mode with the playerswap command disabled (as there is known bug which can be easily abused - i won't state the bug here, mappers/devs know it anyway).

[olivercamel]

I vote:
league mode, (3k gold), but i like to see thinker/trader/exploder enabled in tournament.
-playerswap disabled
random tank is not necessary, i.e. the players decide whether go random or not

For how many games each round I am not sure yet. I'd more like to see 2/3 games for every rounds including semifinal and the final. But i am afraid that make the game arrangement more difficult. For example you cannot play 3 serious bt in a row, that's takes more than 3 hours ... So the 3 games have to be set up in 2 different days.

[Tom-Ace]

I think at the moment the dev team needs to get 8.68 out the door because it has been like 3-4 months sense any real BT version has been out. A lot of you guys seem to be pushing this tournament idea really hard, there is no reason to have cash prize right now, all we need to do is if this is really a wanted thing is to have a tournament without cash to test it out and if people show, stay and play then you can add cash.

Also most people don't know what teams are best for them anyway having 1 or 2 tournaments without any prizes will give most time it find what works for them.

I don't think adding money will bring anyone to bt that didn't like it to start off, there is money in dota why are you guys not leaving BT to play it???