2007-08-28, 22:52:18
I wouldn't consider Tinker imbalanced. In fact, I don't think it's possible to use him after a while because his main purpose is defense, so if you did well you can upgrade into something nice and finish up; if you didn't do so well, you can get some HP and be prepared for a lot of defending (although in situations where a Tinker is the only thing keeping your base from dying, I doubt there's a chance for a comeback). In a "good" game, you could probably use him for up to 30 minutes before he becomes a moot point, at which point you'd better have enough cash for something else. Now, I'll list pros/cons then get to your stuff:
Good uses for Tinker:
- Defense (obv)
- Early-game farming. Like TKF said, if you can get 2-3 towers going and healthy, that's a lot of gold you can get, especially with the level 2 Cannons (the level ones seem to die FAST). If you already have Lasers, you're either really far ahead in terms of level or should have swapped vehicles by now.
- Teleporting. This works both offensively and defensively: at this point a Tinker would have to save up a bit, but I think Troop Command is still pretty viable. Towers as usual, and TP-force an unsuspecting enemy into death (twice if you're lucky). Lately I've been choosing at LEAST one level of TP over Repair, sometimes altogether (as towers/mods are given if you're going tinker-builder). Defensively has been covered: in a single word, missile-dodging.
Bad uses for Tinker:
- Late-game. Now Tinker stands a chance if he's got a Gold Hull (why didn't you get a HT though?) and some weapons, but he's not built for it. None of his skills work well with a gung-ho mode other than Teleport, and oftentimes the Tinker is too weak to be using short-range.
- Anti-Siege enemies. If they start getting Siege Packs, back off while you can, because they're going to rip through you so fast you'll crap your pants. I've seen situations where there is a heavy load of Tinkers on one side: one Siege Pack and they crumbled in a way that it wasn't even satisfying. Heavy Tanks are usually included on this list, although you should be considering a new vehicle by the time they are.
- Inexperienced players. I wish there was a way to let people know that buying a vehicle is a good idea when you're starting out your BTanks career, as I've seen Ice Cannons on an otherwise-naked Tinker. It's pretty sad. :cry:
Most of your argument rests on a comparison between Tinker and the Antigrav. I have my own quirks about that tank (it's just a weird cost where you can't get an "ideal" weapon for him, 'cause not everyone likes the Glaive Thrower), but if we compare the Tinker to Heli or Light Tank, things become a bit different.
Also, if a Tinker is saving up for ONLY a Sky Tank, that's still not much firepower. The enemy probably already has an HT (with appropriate weapons) before your ST and is beating the crap out of your neutral points.
About Antigrav's "Blink": you've very right to put it in quotes, because it's not Blink at all. It's called Jump. It lets you move quickly and over terrain, and (here's why it's useful) has a very low MP cost and cooldown. Naturally it looks a lot like a half-assed Teleport, but it can be used over and over again, whereas another TP will take another minute. I don't think you can blink-dodge with Jump, but the Antigrav also has HP to survive the attack, so it's mostly unnecessary, as you can Jump away to the nearest factory, heal up, and Jump back while their missile is still 2/3s away from cooling.
I've been in situations where a Tinker prevails, but it's typically with the support of non-Tinker vehicles letting me set up in the first place: two or even three mid tanks (neither or which are a bad idea) will shred towers if there's nothing else in the way. Troop Command can't be used instantly anymore, so that's out the window. Basically, it's a good support unit and (obv) requires support to be useful: outside of that, a lone Tinker will fall to an opponent that know what they're doing.
EDIT: Mm, one last thing. I think you're really complaining more about how the other tanks are less useful, rather than the Tinker being too good. Try to go more into detail about improving the Antigrav or Demolisher if you want...I could see some better things about them (up damage on that cone shot of the Demo's, widen AoE on Antigrav's Plasma thing). Those two aside, Light Tanks and Helis can probably beatdown most Tinkers in 1v1.
Good uses for Tinker:
- Defense (obv)
- Early-game farming. Like TKF said, if you can get 2-3 towers going and healthy, that's a lot of gold you can get, especially with the level 2 Cannons (the level ones seem to die FAST). If you already have Lasers, you're either really far ahead in terms of level or should have swapped vehicles by now.
- Teleporting. This works both offensively and defensively: at this point a Tinker would have to save up a bit, but I think Troop Command is still pretty viable. Towers as usual, and TP-force an unsuspecting enemy into death (twice if you're lucky). Lately I've been choosing at LEAST one level of TP over Repair, sometimes altogether (as towers/mods are given if you're going tinker-builder). Defensively has been covered: in a single word, missile-dodging.
Bad uses for Tinker:
- Late-game. Now Tinker stands a chance if he's got a Gold Hull (why didn't you get a HT though?) and some weapons, but he's not built for it. None of his skills work well with a gung-ho mode other than Teleport, and oftentimes the Tinker is too weak to be using short-range.
- Anti-Siege enemies. If they start getting Siege Packs, back off while you can, because they're going to rip through you so fast you'll crap your pants. I've seen situations where there is a heavy load of Tinkers on one side: one Siege Pack and they crumbled in a way that it wasn't even satisfying. Heavy Tanks are usually included on this list, although you should be considering a new vehicle by the time they are.
- Inexperienced players. I wish there was a way to let people know that buying a vehicle is a good idea when you're starting out your BTanks career, as I've seen Ice Cannons on an otherwise-naked Tinker. It's pretty sad. :cry:
Most of your argument rests on a comparison between Tinker and the Antigrav. I have my own quirks about that tank (it's just a weird cost where you can't get an "ideal" weapon for him, 'cause not everyone likes the Glaive Thrower), but if we compare the Tinker to Heli or Light Tank, things become a bit different.
Kenny Wrote:There is also a versatility advantage with the Tinker. If your Tinker is severely mismatched against your opponents, no big deal. The Tinker was free, even if you bought a hull that will still carry 100% over to your next choice, but you lose 50% of the Antigrav's ((note: or any other tank's))price for switching. And since the Tinker is very capable of duking it out until it can afford a Sky Tank or whatever, well 750+ gold isn't anything to sneeze at.Just wanna point out that this is because Tinker CAN'T play the late-game. If he had to be bought like the other vehicles, you wouldn't see nearly as many Tinkers: one as a possible necessity early on (not sure if they're part of a "pro" game often) and that'd be it. Anti-grav, on the other hand, can survive a Heavy Tank shot, and adding just an upgraded Iron Hull gives him plenty of HP to survive on defense or multi-battles.
Also, if a Tinker is saving up for ONLY a Sky Tank, that's still not much firepower. The enemy probably already has an HT (with appropriate weapons) before your ST and is beating the crap out of your neutral points.
Kenny Wrote:While the Antigrav will slightly edge out the (non-upgraded iron hull) Tinker in hitpoints, it also costs more. Much more if the Tinker passes on the hull in favor of killing power. Killing power that exponentially increases as the game goes on. And well, the Antigrav doesn't get an immediate option to increase hit points by 500 (with gold naturally) as necessary...I dunno, I'm not sure where the Tinker's power "exponentially increases". Are you talking about Laser towers? Siege Pack them to hell: it's a great investment considering they'll also be used on all of the enemy's buildings anyway. Farther teleport? If you're not ready to kill a Tinker quickly and efficiently by late-game, regardless of where he goes, you need some work on your early-game. Troop Command (and upgrades)? Every tank after (and including) Air Ship has means of wiping out Reinforcements in one shot, and the Tinker's HP might plummet quite a bit in the process.
About Antigrav's "Blink": you've very right to put it in quotes, because it's not Blink at all. It's called Jump. It lets you move quickly and over terrain, and (here's why it's useful) has a very low MP cost and cooldown. Naturally it looks a lot like a half-assed Teleport, but it can be used over and over again, whereas another TP will take another minute. I don't think you can blink-dodge with Jump, but the Antigrav also has HP to survive the attack, so it's mostly unnecessary, as you can Jump away to the nearest factory, heal up, and Jump back while their missile is still 2/3s away from cooling.
I've been in situations where a Tinker prevails, but it's typically with the support of non-Tinker vehicles letting me set up in the first place: two or even three mid tanks (neither or which are a bad idea) will shred towers if there's nothing else in the way. Troop Command can't be used instantly anymore, so that's out the window. Basically, it's a good support unit and (obv) requires support to be useful: outside of that, a lone Tinker will fall to an opponent that know what they're doing.
EDIT: Mm, one last thing. I think you're really complaining more about how the other tanks are less useful, rather than the Tinker being too good. Try to go more into detail about improving the Antigrav or Demolisher if you want...I could see some better things about them (up damage on that cone shot of the Demo's, widen AoE on Antigrav's Plasma thing). Those two aside, Light Tanks and Helis can probably beatdown most Tinkers in 1v1.
DPS > Range, 'nuff said.